When someone dies: what happens next

With Stass Jones, Co-founder of The Last Hurrah

When someone dies, most of us have no idea what happens next.

Who do you call? How quickly do decisions need to be made? Does the person always have to go straight to a funeral home? And how much choice do families really have?

In this episode of Rest Easy Knowing, Fiona Healy sits down with Stass Jones, co-founder of The Last Hurrah, to demystify the practical and emotional realities that follow a death. Drawing on her experience supporting hundreds of families, Stass explains what happens behind the scenes and challenges many of the long-held assumptions about funeral care.

Together they explore why families shouldn't feel rushed, how much involvement they can have in caring for someone after death, and why funerals are most meaningful when they honestly reflect the life of the person being remembered.

This is a practical, compassionate conversation that will leave you feeling better informed and more confident about navigating one of life's most difficult moments.

In this episode we discuss:

• The first practical steps after someone dies
• When the Coroner becomes involved
• Why families don't need to feel rushed
• How much involvement families can have in caring for someone after death
• Common myths about funeral care
• Personalising a funeral to reflect the person who has died
• Burial, cremation and emerging environmentally conscious choices
• Prepaid funerals and planning ahead
• The rights families have when making funeral arrangements
• Why honest conversations about death help us make more informed decisions

About our guest

Stass Jones is the co-founder of The Last Hurrah, an independent funeral service based in Melbourne that is reimagining funeral care with compassion, honesty and authenticity. With a background in psychology, youth work, disaster response and community support, Stass is passionate about helping families navigate death in ways that reflect their values rather than tradition for tradition's sake.

Key takeaways from this episode

•  Families have more choices than many people realise. 
•  You don't need to rush after someone dies—there is often time to sit with them and say goodbye. 
•  A funeral should reflect the person who died, not simply follow tradition. 
•  Funeral costs vary enormously, so asking for transparent pricing is important. 
•  You have the right to ask how your loved one will be cared for and to be involved if you wish. 
•  Families remain in control—the person in the funeral home's care is still your person.

Practical steps to consider

Death often leaves families making dozens of decisions under enormous emotional pressure. You can make that easier by doing one thing today:

•  Tell someone what kind of farewell you would want. 
•  Write down three things that matter most to you if you were to die unexpectedly. 
•  Ask your family whether they know your wishes. 
•  Research two or three funeral providers before you need one. 
•  Remember that you don't have to accept the first option you're offered - it's ok to ask questions and compare services.

Resources

The Last Hurrah https://www.thelasthurrah.com.au

Transcript

Fiona 0:03

Welcome to Rest Easy Knowing. This is a series about death and dying, and in this episode, we may touch on some detailed aspects of that experience. If this is a sensitive topic for you, listen with care or skip for now. Listener discretion is advised. Most of us are comfortable talking about death, but when it actually happens, many of us don't know where to turn. At the heart of it all is the simple truth. Dignity matters. And more and more families want funerals that feel personal, thoughtful reflections of a lived life rather than something that's done by default. Today I'm speaking with Stas Jones, co-founder of The Last Hurrah Funerals in Thornbury. Stas, her business partner Kimber, and their team support families to farewell their loved ones in ways that are anything but cookie-cutter, creating ceremonies that feel honest, meaningful and deeply personal. Beyond funeral services, they also offer practical guidance from sharing contact details for end-of-life duelers to information about DIY funeral care and help navigating burial and cremation. Because when someone dies, most of us are suddenly asking the same questions. Who do you call? What has to happen next? How quickly do decisions need to be made? And what choices do families actually have? Thanks for joining us today, Staff. Thanks so much for having me, Fiona. It's lovely to be here. So you've worked across not-for-profit funeral care, forensic cleaning, and disaster response. How did you come to be here?

Stass 1:45

Well, I come from a like I studied psychology at uni and I've always kind of been leaning towards the more kind of caring roles. Um, whatever that may look like. I was a youth worker for a while, pretend skateboarder for a while, and everything that I've done has been very much based in community and support, and that's where I've found a lot of comfort in my life. I also grew up being a goth, so I'm living the dream right now. Um I pretend I'm not a goth, but I am head to toe and black, so maybe I still am. But you know, it's it's a pretty special thing to do, and it's just you see people at their absolute best. So working in a field where I get to do that every day is the best thing in the world. I couldn't imagine do anything else now.

Fiona 2:27

So as a young goth, did you did you imagine that you'd be working in this kind of area?

Stass 2:32

Kind of. I always thought I always found death really interesting. I was never really scared of it. Um I grew up in New Zealand where you know, even I'm a Pagiha Kiwi and we bring our people home, and like even my grandfather, who was traditionally Catholic, maybe not super pro-traditional Māori uh functions, um, he came home for three days, and that was a really beautiful thing to do. So we've always been not close to death, but it's been around, and I've never had a fear of it, and I've always found it as a way of bringing families together. And our family on my dad's side, our family funerals have been some of the best parties we've ever had because it's one of the few times where everyone gets together, and you know, some of them get pretty loose by the end of the day, but it's it's a really as hard as it is losing someone, and that's unfathomable in some instances, but what it does to bring people together and bring out the best and people is really pretty cool. So being able to be a part of that process is little Goth Me is very happy about it.

Fiona 3:32

Yeah, it sounds really rewarding.

Stass 3:34

Yeah, very much so.

Fiona 3:35

Yeah. So what led you to establish the last hurrah?

Stass 3:40

I worked for a traditional funeral home. They weren't on for profit, but they were traditional. And I didn't have as many tattoos then, but still they had to be hidden. Uh, I wasn't allowed to wear red lipstick, I had to wear these stupid silk scarves and an ill-fitting polyester uniform. And you have to be, you know, talk like this, and you say loved one, and all the language was really odd. And funnily enough, I ended up getting bullied quite badly in that environment. Um, so it was important to me to create a space where people could be themselves in the face of grief in the way that they support people. Because people don't want something fake and something pretend, and like you're gatekeeping their person. They want something that feels normal, and you know, it sounds like it's not an important thing, but we've had instances where family have called us and told us the situation they're in with losing someone, or someone dying rather. And if you just respond with the F-word, it obviously gauge in the right audience, that can be so soothing because so many people will be like, you know, I'm sorry for your loss, or say something kind of empty, but sometimes the F-word is all that will work when Yeah, it's so real and so recognizing for the people that you're speaking with.

Fiona 4:48

You're talking their language.

Stass 4:50

Absolutely, and you just hear them kind of go, Oh, yeah, they're not being spoken down to. Um, one thing I always say when I first talk to people is that we are looking after your person, so we'll be guided by you, which is tricky for some people because the traditional you go and do the things this way can be really comforting, but just reminding people that it's not our person, we have no con you know, no power over these people, they're not ours. We're just caring for them for a short while. Yeah. On their on their way out.

Fiona 5:18

Yeah. Wow, there's a lot to think about there. Okay, I've got some questions that I'll ask you uh as we progress, but um let's have a little just start at the beginning. What happens after someone dies? What must happen legally and practically?

Stass 5:36

What are the first steps? So it really depends on the situation. So some people will have to go to the coroner's, and that's usually, you know, the police or the ambulance that attend the scene will navigate that. So, you know, they might call a GP, and if it's we've had instances where someone's died at home, it's somewhat unexpected, but say they had a long-standing heart condition, and the doctor will say, Yep, that's fine, I'll sign off on that because that makes a lot of sense. Or sometimes doctors are always on holiday. I don't know what it's about, but they love a holiday, they probably deserve a holiday, let's be honest. But if they can't get onto someone who'll do the medical cause of death certificate, they'll have to go to the coroners. And that's a process in itself and can take, you know, a week or so for their person to be brought into the care of a funeral home.

Fiona 6:19

And that does that mean they're not officially dead till they get a death certificate until the family gets a death certificate? Is that how it works?

Stass 6:26

Ah, but they're not officially they can't determine the cause of death in a straightforward way. So they'll go to the coroners. And well, yeah, there's also other instances, like um, I think it's with C what is it, CJD, with head injuries. If a footy player dies unexpectedly, they'll likely go to the coroners because they're investigating that at the moment. So there's a bunch of different reasons. Or if you've been in the care of government assisted housing, sometimes they'll have to go to the coroners, depending on what the situation is, if they're investigating different kinds of, I think that was when they're doing inquiries. If they're at home and you know, they're on palliative care support or they've got someone there, a nurse or PAL care or someone who can come out and do the verification of death, and that just means that they're confirming that this person is dead, which is such an important part of the process. I've had nightmares about it since we started this business and it's never come up, thank God. Um, but that's like you know, doing simple tests, I think they pinch like between the in the out pit of the elbow and a few other little things to make sure the person is actually deceased, and then we'll uplift them into our care. And the family might call us, palliative care might call us, but the important most important thing for that time is that families don't feel rushed. You know, that's the same process, say if you're in aged care. And most or hospitals, most of them won't rush you along, you know, they won't be like, quick, move out, we've got Nan needs to come in. Some will, and they shouldn't, but you know, you can keep your person at home for a couple of hours. You can when we can guide on ways to make sure the person stays cool, that's really important. Or, you know, closing the windows because flies can be an issue. There's a lot of things we do, and the most important thing I try and get across to families is you don't need to feel rushed. Like if you want to be there, you want to dress them at home. A lot of age care will dress the people, like the amazing staff will dress the person before they come into their care for the family or with the family.

Fiona 8:14

Amazing.

Stass 8:15

And that's a really beautiful thing to do. And also once they're with us, the family can be involved in the care of their person because again, it's their person, it's not ours.

Fiona 8:24

So, how much involvement can the family have in that care? As much as they want.

Stass 8:28

There's really no rules. In Victoria, I think in New South Wales, you can only keep a person at home for a couple of days. Victoria, there's no rules. If someone's going back into the home after coming into our care, we would recommend embalming because that kind that'll allow them to you know make sure they're looking nice and sorry if you're having lunch listening to this. But a big part of death is that death can be quite messy. So, you know, fluids can come out of certain areas. But we've had people, and you know, the job of the funeral director has always been to protect people from that. But we had one gentleman who was just amazing, he'd been looking after his mum at home for two months, and I was like, look, things might happen, and he was like, Of course they would. They've been happening for the last two months, and I'm happy to do it now. Why would I stop straight away? And it's our role as funeral directors is to guide people about what they can face, how we can try and protect them from that, and what they're comfortable taking on, and knowing as well that every step of the way things can change on an instant. So if you decide, nope, I'm done, you know, we can uplift them into our care. You technically never have to go into the care of a funeral home if you don't want to. The industry and the way it works is kind of designed to to lead you towards a funeral director. Um, but you don't have to. You can take your nan to the crematorium and your station wagon if you want. But it's it's not easy. And people who do that are pretty amazing, especially at such a damn hard time. Yeah. But I don't know if I'm this is good for business, but you don't need us. But we can support you in the parts that they make it hard.

Fiona 9:56

Yeah. I was reading about the growth in um death over the next twenty five years and how significant that's going to be. I guess those services or a variety of different services to d to suit different families' needs are kind of required. Yeah.

Stass 10:15

Absolutely. And there's there's a lot of talk about, say, the oh there's a terrible article in the age about briefcase operators. And you know, for some people, the whole shebang with a $50,000 coffin and a church and everything is perfect. And some people don't see not value, it's not the right way to put it. Say my own thoughts are the way my family will live on is in their legacy and how they've affected the people around them. So it's that that lives on. So the care of the body itself isn't really important to me because once they've died, that's not them.

Fiona 10:45

Yeah.

Stass 10:45

So there is a place for those people who'll just whist them away, and you know, there's so many people say, Chuck me in a box and then the bin. That doesn't happen. But you know, there's a place for those people that's less formal. You can do it online, that's fine if it works for some people, and it won't work for everyone, but there's enough people that are doing enough different things to for everyone to be supported and whatever they feel see fit. And I think that's really important. We it's not our role to tell people how they should care for their person at all.

Fiona 11:08

Yeah. I was reading that more and more people are moving away from those traditional style funerals and looking for the kind of heartfelt service that you guys offer. Yeah.

Stass 11:20

Yeah. Yeah. And like it is still quite traditional. It's still, you know, you go to a service, our start generally start with a glass of bubbles. That helps. But you know, you've got your traditional things of people that love the person, get up and speak. You've got a photo presentation, you've got music they love. They're there in the casket or coffin, or they're there as ashes. Like there's still the traditional kind of elements that provide comfort, but you can add in, we've had dance parties with lasers and smoke machines, we've been at the tote with a Viking metal band. But you know, there's traditional elements within the less traditional elements, which is pretty special.

Fiona 11:55

And what do you think that does for the people that are left behind to have something that's so bespoke and true to the nature of the person that's died?

Stass 12:05

I think a big thing we always hear is they're left feeling lighter. Because of who we are and how how we roll, I would say we our primary people we care for are a lot younger. Um, and within that dive, generally more tragic, well not more tragic, but you know, more unexpected, really quite shocking circumstances. So it's our job to hold people through that time. And that's why having something personal that really speaks to the person, but also the manner of death, a big thing for us is we won't shy away from who the person really was. That can be pretty fun sometimes, but you know, if someone struggled with mental health, if someone struggled with addiction, it's taking away the shame from that for them and also everyone that loved them, and especially with suicide, naming that talking to the people that love them and reassuring them about how, you know, not telling them how to feel, but however they feel is absolutely acknowledging how the end came so that everyone can talk about it, yeah. Definitely, and that's so important. We've come, we've got a few rules, a few kind of I'd say rules, yeah, that we won't do a funeral now if a suicide's not being spoken about. Um, of course there's ways around it and you know, special considerations, but we won't get up and lie. And I think that's something that was when we made that decision, it felt really good.

Fiona 13:29

Yeah.

Stass 13:29

Because I, you know, everyone has a story, f a family story of someone who, you know, died unexpectedly, no one knows what happened, but everyone's kind of you know uh assuming what has happened, which is harder for people and harder for people to grasp and make sense of and then grieve fully.

Fiona 13:45

And when you have a vacuum of information that leaves space for people to make stuff up, that's not real, right?

Stass 13:51

Absolutely, and you know, you always think the worst, you always scandalize things a bit. It's just how humans are. So if you can speak about it honestly and beautifully, and we've families who have experienced the most profound loss have spoken about it in such a a way that we never could, and it's just it's just amazing.

Fiona 14:11

I've got a question about the logistics.

Stass 14:14

I love logistics, it's where I shine.

Fiona 14:17

So I know that you've got a beautiful hearse. When someone dies and the body gets taken across to you, do they go in the hearse? Or do they go in some other kind of transport?

Stass 14:30

So we've just started our own um what they call transfer company. So we when we first started, we started with a projector and a a screen, and then we've gone to here where we are now, which is mind-blowing. But we've started doing our own transfers where we'll go to people and we use an old hearse that we've kind of blacked out. His name's Denny, he's a 1993 Ford, he's real slimy looking. Um does the trick, he looks great. So we'll send out a mustache. Pretty much. Even it's sleazy uncle vibes, we love him. Um but we send Denny out and we've trained up a team in our way of doing things, but prior to that, there's what you call transfer companies. So they'll come to someone's home and or you know, the hospital or the car owners, it's usually in a white van or a silver van. They usually dress them like waiters, which is weird, they're always wearing a um vest and a tie.

Fiona 15:17

Yeah.

Stass 15:18

And I've had families being like, I was waiting for them to serve me a cocktail. But yeah, so you it's generally in an unmarked vehicle because you technically the person needs to be covered because uh legally you're not meant to be able to see the person in the vehicle.

Fiona 15:33

Yeah.

Stass 15:33

Which is the same in the her, say, for a funeral, you couldn't have if you've got someone a shroud and bearer where they're wrapped on those beautiful kind of timber bearers, that has to have a lid over it for transport because heaven forbid someone sees someone.

Fiona 15:47

And shrouded burial, is that new in Victoria or how long's that been a possibility?

Stass 15:54

It's always been a possibility. I know in the Muslim phase it's really big, but now you can do it anywhere. It's really beautiful. We always recommend getting more regional. So in Melbourne, you know, say you want to be buried in one of the major cemeteries in Melbourne, it's upwards of fifteen thousand dollars for a grave. Melbourne Central, that's another you can buy a house for that. But you know, if you go a little bit further out, you've got natural burials there that are just beautiful, and they're so much cheaper. So we a lot of our families tend to go in the outer suburbs of Melbourne, like um Yarrow Valley Way or the Dandenongs, there's some amazing spots, a lot around kind of the goldfields. A lot of our families choose to go out there.

Fiona 16:32

Amazing is to be buried. Yeah. And shrouded burials, do they go as deep?

Stass 16:40

So it depends. There's the natural burial in its purest form is a meter deep, so that's a bit more shallow, and it that aids the kind of decomposition process happening a bit faster, but you're safe from foxes and wombats. Uh, you know, and you can't have embalming or you can't have a whole plastic outfit on or anything like that, it's all natural fibres. But there's kind of a scale of natural burials, so there's some places where you can have casket, or there's some places that do the six feet burial, but they've got natural kind of surroundings. It's a whole scale, but in the traditional sense, it's a meter deep.

Fiona 17:15

I was at a a Doula kind of conference recently where they were talking about tucking objects of importance in into the shroud and uh they were discussing crystals and how that's great if the person's going to be buried, but if they're going to be cremated, it's it's probably not a good idea. Well, you know that glass.

Stass 17:39

Crystals actually haven't come up. Uh-huh. But yeah, I wouldn't go with a huge one, but a little crystal won't do any harm.

Fiona 17:48

Are there common misunderstandings that family have families have around timelines or what must happen or who has responsibility for what role? Those sorts of things.

Stass 17:59

Yeah, timelines is a big one. We generally recommend at least a week and a half if you're doing a full funeral celebration. But you know, someone can come into our care and their cremation can be the next day if you're not having like a you know big shebang. Because it's a lot of work to get done, and you know, it often falls on one person to manage it all and do it all whilst you're in a really, really terrible state. But also, I think planning a funeral has a function of keeping you a little bit busy and distracted during the worst time. But there's no strict time frames. We yeah, generally recommend a week and a half as a good amount of time, but not too long. But some people will have, like, say, a private cremation and then have something on a date of significance further down the line. There's no right or wrong way of doing things. So with cremations, people often think it either they can collect the person on the day or they have to wait for weeks. It's generally the process itself can take around three or four hours, but we can't get the ashes back till that two or three days after.

Fiona 19:01

I was speaking with uh another funeral provider who told me that the one of the top questions that they get asked is, are the ashes that are received back definitely the ashes of the person that has passed away and died? Yeah.

Stass 19:16

Yeah, that's a big one. And there's like in Victoria, it's all through government trust. So it's really heavily regulated. And there's like a little nameplate on the coffin that has to travel with the person at every step of the way. So no, and a big one I always get to is do they take them out of the coffin for cremation? And can we just like sell it back to you? It's like, no, you have to get cremated in the coffin that they're in, and you can't reuse a coffin, yeah, which is probably for the best. That's right. Yeah.

Fiona 19:44

And handles on coffins, do they come off or no, they stay on?

Stass 19:52

Um, they're usually that really kind of like plastic painted plastic, so they're not metal, so they'll just disintegrate really.

Fiona 19:59

So if you pick up a coffin with a body in it by the handles, is it strong enough? Absolutely.

Stass 20:07

It doesn't make sense to me because they do feel like pretty crappy plastic, yeah, but they're plenty strong enough. I'd say 90% of our services we use the cardboard caskets, yeah, and they've got like rope handles, and they're absolutely fine. They say up for 240 kilos, but I don't trust that. I wouldn't risk I wouldn't run the gauntlet there. But you know, well, most of ours have timber handles. We very rarely use those kind of traditional plasticky numbers.

Fiona 20:30

Yeah. And the cardboard caskets, how much are they? What do they cost?

Stass 20:36

We include them in our services, like in our packages of the base, because yeah, as I said, most people use that, but they're $300. Right. Which is still kind of expensive for a cardboard box when you think about it. But you know, a lot of the alternatives for something simple are like MDF that are kind of slapped together. So as a comparison to that, but there's a lot of I don't want to say greenwashing, but you know, cardboard's a great option, it's simple. Families love to draw on it and it can look so beautiful. But you also consider that you know that it's come they come from South Africa, there's a lot of water used in the production. So whilst we love it and we try and be as green as we can, we also acknowledge that this industry isn't inherently pretty damn wasteful. And we also have a 1973 Cadillac Hearst, which is particularly so. But it's you know, just trying to manage that where we can. Yeah, there's a lot of faux green narratives in the funeral industry.

Fiona 21:28

Yeah, I used to, for a short time I lived near a a cemetery that had loads of loads of olive trees. And it was olive season, and I was gathering the olives thinking I was going to cure them. And then later on I thought, oh, I wonder what's in the ground. Like all those chemicals that that are, you know, included in the caskets and whatnot. I thought probably best not to eat them. Ah, yeah, thank you, Bero.

Stass 21:53

Um well, there's a lot of I don't know if it's true or not, but I've been told it by several embalmers. But also they're embarrassed, they've got a vested interest. But apparently, so the big buzzword is around a bombing is for male to hide. But it apparently once that meets a protein, it's neutralized, so it doesn't exist anymore. I've been trying to find scholarly articles on this, and I can't. Um, and to be honest, I haven't looked that hard lately because I've been busy, but I think the bigger issue with burial and things would be the MDF and all the what do they call it? Plisse, I don't know why, in 2026. They still have coffins with like, you know, the vintage dole outfits with like the white lace and frills and it's like that real plasticky satin crap. Yeah, it looks like it should be on a 1900s dole. It's weird. And you think of all that crap and plastic and chemicals that be on the production of that. So we tend to use ones that are like calico lining in that yeah, gorgeous. Yeah, it's it's weird. There's just traditional things that are always done that don't seem to be changed for so long. So I don't think anyone's into Plisse anymore.

Fiona 22:59

Sounds like a good thing. Yeah. So is there anything going on behind the scenes that you wish other people knew about from your perspective?

Stass 23:09

With funeral care. I think the main thing is just that the person might, you know, the person might be in the care of the funeral director, but they're your person. You've got say over what happens to them when it happens. You should know what's happening, you know, if you want to. If you don't want to know, they can do what they like. But I just think the ownership of the person is the family. And I that's very much forgotten. And almost uh I think traditionally the funeral industry is kind of gatekeeped a person, and I think that's really bad.

Fiona 23:38

It works in their favour, doesn't it? Yeah. Oh, yeah. To kind of have the we've got all the knowledge, so like even with viewings, some people be like, oh no, you can't view someone, and there's you know, became say because of the manner of their deaths.

Stass 23:52

And there's only been one instance in our seven-year history, god that's gone fast, where we've just said no because it was a very significant case of decomposition and a really there was no way of making it safe for the people to see this person. But quite often people say they've been in an accident, they've got grazers. Seeing their person with those grazers can actually be quite healing. Obviously, it's not easy and it's really hard, but it's important we'll do our best if someone needs to see someone, especially in the instance of a sudden death, that they have that opportunity. And you know, someone seeing their son will look past, you know, the grazers and you know, some imperfections just to see their their boy who died so quick so suddenly. So it's ownership of the person is the main thing that I want people to know they have, no matter where they are.

Fiona 24:40

Yeah. And those moments the family have with their person. Do you see that making a big difference for them and their grieving process?

Stass 24:48

Definitely. It's one of my favourite tasks of this job, really, because we're in our space and Thornbury families will come in and it'll be really hard, and there'll be wailing and crying and questions, and some of the things you hear people say to their person is just heartbreaking. But then throughout the time there slowly lifts and laughing happens and jokes at the dead person's expense, which is so healing. But you know, those stories happen, and in the space of a couple of hours, you see that lightness happen, and very rarely have we had people say it wasn't a good thing to do. And I always reassure people that we're not, unless it was their chosen thing, we're not going to dress them up like Dame Edna because I think everyone of our generation has this horrible thought of seeing their person and they're bright orange or they look weird, and we tend not to cosmatize unless we have to, and if we do, we always tell people it's like, look, he's wearing a little bit of foundation, but this is why. So as long as we talk everyone through what they will see, it's a really beautiful and healing thing to do.

Fiona 25:49

Yeah, I remember seeing my aunt was decades ago, and she was quite heavily made up. She liked a lot of makeup, so that made sense. But her the backs of her hands were really blue, you know, there was quite a contrast between her hands and her face.

Stass 26:07

The hands are such an important part. They're really we know we've had feelings where a person wants to see their face because it was quite damaged, but you know, you can have their hands out and they can hold their hands and see their hands, and that's a really special hands are really important and handwriting too, I love it.

Fiona 26:24

And I have a question, you were you were speaking about families knowing that this is their person. Have you ever found yourself in a position where there are different members of the family who think they're the one that's the key contact and the the go-to person? Very much so.

Stass 26:42

How do you deal with that? Quite often in those instances, the person's coup instances, the persons come from the coroners. So the coroners have identified the next of kin and that's our next of kin. That's great because it takes the onus off us. But you know, there's rules about who is the next of kin and in which capacity. But you see a lot of really interesting and pretty sad family dynamics at play. That's a big part of what we do. And it might just be like a rogue uncle who wants to pop in a racist joke or something, and that's manageable. But managing family dynamics is a huge part of our role, and we've got ways that we can engage with people and support them in what they need and also kind of keep them at a slight distance as yeah. The psychic background comes in handy on that front. But I bet, yeah. Managing expectations and families is a huge part of what we do. The hardest part I'd say.

Fiona 27:37

And what about repatriation? What if somebody dies overseas? How do we get them back? And what what kind of process does a family go through?

Stass 27:49

Yeah, it's a pardon the pun, it's a massive undertaking. And it depends on where you're coming from around the world. There's systems, you know, there's consulates and systems in place. Always have insurance, always. Travel insurance, rather, very important. Although if you are with the current world the way it is, it's not covered with war, so that's hard. But you basically need to be embalmed as much as humanly possible. So you will embalming in uh instance, repatriation is as far as you can go, which you know, for a lot of people of our generation is something they definitely don't want. I'm hitting overseas soon and wherever I go, it's just cremate me over there and bring me home.

Fiona 28:30

Yeah.

Stass 28:31

But then you have to be in a fully sealed casket, and there's like a you know those vac pack kind of bags? Yes, yes. That's what's used to make sure that you know it's all secure, and then you're placed in a big crate that's put on a flight, and then the family quite often have the option of travelling home with you on that flight. And you go in the cargo, and it's much the same as any other way coming home. But you know, logistics-wise, say if you're coming from Australia to New Zealand, that's the main one because there's so many of us here. Yeah, you know, you'd get the death certificate really quickly, that has to happen before you can travel, and the whole process would take around a week minimum to get the person on the flight home.

Fiona 29:08

I guess the insurance company kind of takes over and manages everything, providing you've got insurance, as you say, yeah.

Stass 29:14

The insurance company and the consulate are the two that will really and luckily in Australia we've got such good support. But depending on where you die and the manner of death, it's it's a pretty huge thing to do.

Fiona 29:24

Yeah. And what about interstate kind of travel needs? Uh, if if somebody dies, I don't know, up north and they'd actually need to be brought back down.

Stass 29:36

Is it a similar kind of much? It's much easier. You've just um they've got there's certain companies that have refrigerated vehicles, yeah, and they'll, you know, drive from Darwin to Melbourne and bring the person down. It's pretty straightforward in Australia, which is handy given how big it is. I wouldn't want to be doing that.

Fiona 29:51

So are there but are there different laws in each state and territory that relate to your sector?

Stass 29:57

And there are each state is very different. Like, say, for example, in Victoria, all crematoriums and cemeteries have to be owned by government trust. New South Wales that isn't the case, which is why so many Victorian-based funeral homes pop across the border for cremation. We offer it to our families because it's $400 cheaper and it's faster. And we really love the people that operate that for us on the other side of the border, but we always let the families know. And most of them are like, yeah, let's do a road trip because that's $400 on the bar tab. Yeah. And it's, you know, like most of our family most of our families choose that option. And we've been there and checked it out and we really like them. So there's different, you know, even say New South Wales, you can't keep a person at home for too long. Perth has some different rules. So yeah, every state is quite different. But transporting people between states is pretty straightforward.

Fiona 30:41

Okay. And are there any permits or documentation required for burial?

Stass 30:48

Burial, oh my gosh, there's the most confusing paperwork. There's two forms you need, and they've got almost the exact same heading. One's to own the grave and one's to dig the hole effectively. So that paperwork sucks. But it's just two forms and it's pretty straightforward. For cremation in Victoria, if the person doesn't go to the coroner's, you need to have a second doctor to sign off that it's okay for the cremation to happen. Because I've seen death certificates, not with us, but through, especially in America, where the doc the initial doctors list of the cause of death is stopped breathing. That's not really safe. So obviously, once you cremate someone, you can't investigate the death any further.

Fiona 31:25

Yeah.

Stass 31:26

So we you know, the body itself. So you have to get a second doctor to sign that off. And that's pretty much that and a cremation authority from the family, is all you need. But we've had instances where families look after their person themselves and we just do that bit of paperwork for them. Yeah, the paperwork's a pain in the arse.

Fiona 31:42

Yeah, with everything else you've got going on, you can really although I find I found a lot of our families.

Stass 31:48

I'm the same. I find paperwork quite soothing. So if you can tick off boxes and do it, and I'll um talk to families and I'll get it back to us for minutes. And it's like, oh, I just needed something that I could tune out and fill out. Something to focus on. Yeah.

Fiona 32:00

Uh do symmetry or council rules vary?

Stass 32:04

Not really. It's all covered by the same Victorian Government Act. So it's pretty similar. The council symmetries are really lovely to work with. Don't know why, they're amazing. But yeah, it's all pretty much the same rules across the board. But say SMCT, which is the kind of the larger one on the other side of the river, what current side of the river, they're putting in rules like say they have to have a gantry to lower the casket, which is a big lowering device thingy. And there's a lot of pushback from cultural people and things like that. And obviously something's happened where there was an OHS issue, and they're putting in this gantry, but there's a lot of pushback, and they're actually listening, which is really good. But some cemeteries put their own kind of processes in place, but it's not the general laws are still the same.

Fiona 32:46

Yeah, okay.

Stass 32:47

So, what's a funeral likely to cost? Heaps. With us, we're around, I'd say, mid-range. Looking, say, at an unattended cremation, we have the person which come into the care of a funeral director, be placed in a coffin or casket and get taken for cremation. I think in Melbourne you're looking at from some providers around $1,800 and some providers uh $7,000 for the exact same thing or more. But with ours, the biggest cost is usually food and drinks. Yeah. Because that's a huge part of what our people love and things. But you'd be looking at a minimum of $10,000 for a proper big funeral.

Fiona 33:27

So what happens with people who are say living in community housing or uh don't have a family to care about what happens to them after they've passed away? How does that work?

Stass 33:41

It's pretty hard. There's not a lot of support. There is something you can get called a part 10, and that's provided through the coroners. You don't have to go on to the coroners to receive this, but you provide a stat deck and evidence that you've got very little funds, and that'll cover the cost of a cremation or a burial at one of a few cemeteries around Victoria. But in that you cannot have a ceremony with it. So it's just, I guess, what traditionally would have been called a pauper's service. And that is a possibility. Cinderlink quite often pays out a few payments after someone's died, and that's designed to support the funeral costs. But when you think about it, that's there's all a lot of other costs around death and dying other than just someone being rather than their disposition. But there are some grants you can get, no cost loans.

Fiona 34:33

Yeah.

Stass 34:33

But there's not a hell of a lot of support.

Fiona 34:35

We do have like a bit of a process to go through if it's already difficult.

Stass 34:39

And you know, we've had instances where that someone's been estranged from their family for decades, and the next of kin is their daughter that they haven't spoken to in 40 years. They didn't even know where they didn't actually know they were still alive. And they've they have to try and produce these documents and they're like, I didn't even know he was still around.

Fiona 34:55

Yeah.

Stass 34:55

It's a lot of pressure and it's a lot of a lot of stress. But there's also state trustees, which a lot of they'll cover some funerals if you're already engaged with them. But again, it's generally just a direct cremation.

Fiona 35:06

So what happens with the ashes of those people?

Stass 35:11

It depends. We've actually been requested to throw people in the bin. I didn't do that. I said, Well, I'm going to the uh a river, so we'll take them to the river. Didn't plan that very well and was downstream and we went to go for a swim and that wasn't ideal. My kids weren't stoked.

Fiona 35:27

The last blessing.

Stass 35:30

But um, yeah, it's honestly you can do with ashes really what you like. But it is tricky when no one wants to claim them. But it's whoever signs the documentation can make that relevant. And if they want to put them in the bin, they can do that. I'd recommend taking off the identification before they do, but yeah, but it's each to their own, I guess. But you can't sprinkle at the MCG, that's a big one. Comes up.

Fiona 35:53

And what about at the beach or that's fine? Yeah. Yeah. I know quite a few people that have done that. Yeah. But they've done it sort of quietly and you know, tried to do it surreptitiously. So there's a lot of that.

Stass 36:07

It's each to their own. We kind of respect a little bit of rogue. We've had, I call it the Shawshank Redemption Method, where we've had people just put a little bit on the grounds of the MCG, so you can't really tell.

Fiona 36:17

Just to empty a little spoonful out of their pocket and whatever. Good on them. And what do you think about prepaid funerals? We have recently started doing it.

Stass 36:26

We haven't been able to in the past because we're such a small team and we're generally operating at capacity. Prepaid's a good way to go. It really is. Because the cost of funerals goes up by around about 10% a year. So if you can secure that cost now, we've got 20 years to go, it'll be fine. And once you've paid that amount, you don't have to pay anymore. Insurance is obviously different. I know people who've missed an insurance payment and then lost everything.

Fiona 36:52

Yeah.

Stass 36:52

But prepaid, because that's all with a trust as well. So it's never held by the funeral company. So even if, you know, 20 years down the line, heaven forbid we're not around, you can use that to go to another funeral company. But it's I think it's a really great thing to do if you can be bothered. But there's also funeral bonds if you just want to put money aside. But it's good because it's not means tested, it's not included in your wealth when you're means tested for pensions and things like that. So it's a good thing to do if you if you can.

Fiona 37:22

What sort of questions should a family ask when they're trying to decide who to go with?

Stass 37:30

I think money's a big one. Ask them costs, and you know, it's hard. People always call up and be like, how much does a funeral cost? I was like, Oh, I don't, what do you want? You know, I just want something simple, and what something simple can be so different to everyone. But I think kind of having a clear idea of what you'd like, even sometimes it's easy to start with what you absolutely don't like, and then seeing how they respond and just get across what's important to you. I guess money's a big one, and just the general vibe. When I was shopping around for my grandfather's funeral in Christchurch in New Zealand, and some of the responses I got, they just felt gross. And then some were really beautiful and really engaged, and I think the vibe's the main one.

Fiona 38:08

Do you find that you're responding to calls much from people who are shopping around? Or do people just sometimes pick a local or pick something that's familiar in the street?

Stass 38:19

What how how do all of the above really like a lot of people, most of ours, we don't do any marketing, so most of our funerals come from people who've been at other funerals. Some do shop around and you know, just ask the questions, and we always like we get a lovely lady who just her experience of death was beyond words, and she was currently with another funeral company, and I was like, look, there's virtue to staying with them because hey, she's already there. What they'll do will be beautiful and straightforward and easy, and it's really important that what happens right now is easy on you, and that's your primary goal. She ended up coming to us anyway, but whatever feels right, and you know, if white ladies feel right to you, they'll provide a beautiful service. Yeah, you know, if whoever feels right to you is all that matters.

Fiona 39:05

And in going through the process, is there anything that families should be maybe aware of that they're not that people generally don't even think about?

Stass 39:14

I think I hope beyond all hope that all funeral providers in Victoria are doing their absolute best in caring for people. If it's important to you that your person is bathed and dressed, which is important to a lot of people, ask the question and make sure they will be if that's important to you. If it's not, all power to you. But I just it's really whatever feels important for you. Everyone's so different that the only question you need to ask is that if you're happy with how your person's being cared for. And you have every right to ask all those questions. Like it's important to us that people know our clients know exactly when the person's with us in Thornbury, exactly what's going to happen, how everything looks, and that's an important part. So if that's important to the family too, that's what you should be looking for.

Fiona 40:01

Yeah.

Stass 40:02

And make sure it aligns with your values as well. Like if you're a traditional Italian Catholic family, we're probably not the one for you. Um, and that's okay.

Fiona 40:10

So, you know, if there's different kinds of different strokes for different folks, and so after all the funerals that you've been involved with, what makes a funeral really meaningful?

Stass 40:22

Hmm. I think honesty. Like talking about the person in a really real and honest way. Like you see, the way parents talk about the loss of their child and who they were, and when it's really honest and really beautiful and really reflective of who they are, that's what it's about.

Fiona 40:42

And has working around death changed the way you think about your own life?

Stass 40:47

Absolutely. You know, I'd love to buy a house one day, it's not easy in Melbourne, but what's most important to me is travelling with my family. So we've prioritised that over saving for a house we'll probably never get. So the whole working in this field makes you realise that life can end at any moment. So you've got to live it and be kind and soak up every bit of adventure and experience you can. Says me who spends way too much time on the couch watching trash TV. But you know, actually having experiences that change your life is what's most important to me and our family, and that's yeah, the best outcome. And we certainly do that pretty well.

Fiona 41:29

Have you got any final thoughts for the listeners?

Stass 41:33

No, just take it easy. I think that's the biggest everyone feels flustered, like they've got to do everything straight away and make all these huge decisions. Just be kind to yourself and do whatever feels right.

Fiona 41:45

Thank you so much, Stass. You're most welcome. It's been lovely speaking with you. It's been lovely being here. Thank you. And music is by Sapiros.